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WordArt in OOO.org 2.0
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beonex
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 06, 2004 9:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes Wordart in Openoffice. That is good
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8daysaweek.co.uk
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2004 7:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

docjollywood wrote:
The key there was MS Office 97. That's an office suite that is 7 years old. I have used MS Word to print off hugely long documents (docjollywood useless fact... I want to be a novelist) from Word 2000, Word XP, and Word 2003... and in all of these instances it proved fast, responsive, and never hiccoughed or crashed. Moreover it's only fair to compare to MS Office 2003. Otherwise 7 years from now, MS fan boys could be arguing about the problems with OOo 1.1. That wouldn't make for a good argument because surely 7 years from now OOo, won't much resemble OpenOffice.org of today.

Point taken - TBH I hadn't picked up that AB was specifically talking about 97.
Although there are still Writer advantages other than reliability IMO, like (for instance):
  • XML (open) file format and small file size
  • AB says "The styles are confusing and hard to manage" personally I've found them much easier to manage than in Word (he may still be referring to v1.0.3 but I didn't use that much)
but I think there is still some "catching up" to do!

docjollywood wrote:
Now with all that said I need to point out one last time I wasn't attacking, I appreciate your information.

No, I didn't feel "under attack" when I said "almost wish I hadn't" it's been a good discussion - I would have been far more vociferous in my "defence" if I though you were flaming or being "awkward" Wink or maybe I wouldn't have replied!

docjollywood wrote:
Unfortunately I guess the answer I'm looking at right now is there is no "GOOD" solution for a WordArt substitute in OpenOffice.org 1.1, and as far as any of us know thus far, we are NOT staring at a 2.0 solution either. I guess I'd better get voting and keep complainging! Wink Cool

Yes, that seems to be the case at the moment. I think it must difficult for the developers to direct their efforts efficiently without knowing what is most important for everyone - the voting system seems to be a good way of doing this esp as we have limited votes and so must cast these carefully.
<rant>What is mildly irritating is the number of people who seem capable of finding the openoffice.org site, registering and viewing bug reports and then don't bother searching before posting a duplicate request! I'm not accusing anyone here just commenting</rant>

docjollywood wrote:
P.S. Anyone care to tell me why the heck I started this thread calling it OOO.org Writer? What was I talking about OpenOpenOffice.org??? Rolling Eyes
LOL Laughing
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2004 9:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I use word processors in a more profesional way as part of my job, so thus have little use for stuff like "Word art". I know kids and people who love rainbow gradient text in all their documents love it, but I think that sort of thing is better served in prodcuts like print shop.
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Earthshaker
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2004 12:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well Guest, wordart does more that make gradient rainbows, I just got done making a couple of items that have curved text in the heading. I use open office.org because it does most of what I want to do, and I don't have an IT department with thousands of dollars of budget to play with.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2004 3:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Curved text is handled fairly well in OO.

The most bitching I see is about the supposed lack of gradients and so on.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2004 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And oh yeah, one does not "an IT department with thousands of dollars of budget to play with." to do simple gradient or curved text.

If OO doesn't do it as you wish, buy one of the very inexpensive "print shop" type programs and use those. They tend to allow you to contort and color text in ways that even word art does not allow.
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docjollywood
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 08, 2004 9:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anonymous wrote:
If OO doesn't do it as you wish, buy one of the very inexpensive "print shop" type programs and use those.


Alas, the solution I always hate to hear. Buy so and so, or use another program and incorporate blah, blah. Why use 5 programs to accomplish what could easily be done with one? This fact here is what irritates me about the company I work for. We're always making "NEW" products rather than improving the one's we already have. For a commercial product that is simply unacceptable.

Now for a free office suite such as OpenOffice there isn't a lot to complain about (or bitch about as you so eloquently put it). In general though I don't like when people tell others to use something else. Obviously we know we could accomplish a task if we used something else. But we want to be able to do so with what we're currently using. Isn't that only natural?

Case in point, somebody else here said that they use WordArt and then copy and paste it into OOo. That's fine if that works for them, but I would find that to be a nuisance. Besides isn't the goal to get people to migrate away from MS Office? If we're going to suggest using it as well as OpenOffice what motivation does one have to even try OOo?
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Kaaredyret
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 09, 2004 6:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The OOo team is currently quite busy with improving the suite as a whole. But somebody could easily code a word art feature that could be added to OOo later?

OOo would benefit dramatically from plugins etc. from the community, not just the programmers that are working on StarOffice/OpenOffice normally.
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 09, 2004 9:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

docjollywood wrote:

Alas, the solution I always hate to hear. Buy so and so, or use another program and incorporate blah, blah.
Older (yet still fully functional copies of print shop type programs can be had for around $10.00. Adding this type of functionality into the suite tends to bloat it and make it slower for those not wanting to use gradient text warped in 500 different kinds of ways.

Quote:
Now for a free office suite such as OpenOffice there isn't a lot to complain about (or bitch about as you so eloquently put it). In general though I don't like when people tell others to use something else. Obviously we know we could accomplish a task if we used something else. But we want to be able to do so with what we're currently using. Isn't that only natural?
Natural doesn't always equal "reasonable". Runaway feature creep has made MS office the bloated mess it is today. Is that what we want for Open office?

Quote:
If we're going to suggest using it as well as OpenOffice what motivation does one have to even try OOo?
Perhaps teens into "kewl" text effects and those wanting to use their word processor as a cut rate page layout proggy might feel they need it. Ask yourself this, would you rather folks be working on fixing issues with file compatiblity with word or would your rather have them wasting time and systems resources on adding more wordart style bloat? If one wants to create newsletter, greeting card, business card, or other graphic that doesn't fall within the purview of a word processor, I don't think it's inappropriate to ask them to use a separate, more appropriate program for it. Seeing how these print shop type of proggys can be had cheaply and are dirt simple to use, I fail to see how it's a strong imposition on anyone. Perhaps some want Open office to be "jack of all trades, master of none", but that person isn't me. Smile
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 09, 2004 9:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh yes, I quite agree with the poster suggesting a plugin framework. That would allow folks to add silly crap like word art if they want while not saddling more serious users with it.
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The Liquidator
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 10, 2004 2:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, it's crappy and tacky and it encourages laziness but, let's face it, loads of people (mainly the kids I think) use it.

This does raise a serious issue, that of what M$ Features do we wish to emulate and what do we not. My view is that it would be a worthwhile feature on the basis that for many young folks this is really the only feature that they use in Word that is not in OOo but, in their view, it is a key one - it enables some "pretty" work to be done quickly and easily.

The problem is that if as kids they perceive OOo as an inferior substitute , that view will be deep-rooted. Get round that and you can immediately widen the user base a lot.

Ian
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Dilbert
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 10, 2004 9:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anonymous wrote:
Oh yes, I quite agree with the poster suggesting a plugin framework. That would allow folks to add silly crap like word art if they want while not saddling more serious users with it.


Rolling Eyes

What is wrong with some of you guys? Silly crap? Not at all. I find it disturbing that so many people on this board does not understand what users want and what they use OpenOffice and MS Word for. Far too many posts here gives the impression that the posters thinks of Writer and word processors as an advanced text editor, or something that is reserved for SERIOUS use.

Why DO YOU think that Microsoft and Novell/Corel added WordArt/TextArt to their word processors? Do you think that someone said "THINK ABOUT THE CHILDREN" and then sobbing programmers made WordArt, just to impress children, morons and donkeys?

No, the made it because there was a DEMAND for something like WordArt. The clear majority of documents created in Microsoft Word are 1-2 page documents. I have seen WordArt used in THOUSANDS of invitations, posters, anything! Anywere! Art work, the university, the dorm I lived in, "Have you seen my cat" posters...
The same person that wrote his thesis in Word could need a quick and lovely tool for an invitation to his party saturday. Someone making a poster for a gathering of some hundred people could need it too. It takes 10 minutes to design such posters in Word and WordPerfect, but can be done in Writer. Using Draw... it takes forever. Will OpenOffice.org benefit from that? Rolling Eyes

I makes me ANGRY to read "silly crap"! ANGRY! The discussion should mostly be about the priority of the task of developing it. Right now the priority should be low. But later such a feature would be lovely. I don't need it, but I have seen it used so much during that last 7 years that calling it silly crap would be to insult all the people that made the posters and invitations I have seen.

People use a word processor for ANYTHING today. Respect that. OpenOffice.org is an open source project, so anyone could work for a wordart clone of some sort. It sounds like a fun task to me.

But PLEASE, before calling feature for crap, try to understand what normal people do with their software... and please understand that no general user would use Draw for this. kind of work.
Rolling Eyes
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Kaaredyret
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 10, 2004 4:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The is actually a basic WordArt feature in Draw, it is just a matter of integrating this a little with Writer etc. and enhancing it a lot!

As I remember it, Microsoft made a great effort to seperate features like this from one program to make it available to all programs in their office suite. OOo could do the same.

Hmm, working a little with Font Work was no joy. Right clicking the text did not make the menu item re-appear... how the heck do I change the curve that the text follows. Evil or Very Mad

Font Work is not good enough. But it could easily be improved!

(The PDF export of my Font Works object is horrible by the way... Crying or Very sad )
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The Liquidator
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 11, 2004 2:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think that an M$ Wordart equivalent would be a great thing for OOo to have. In my humble opinion if it were possible to assign a gradient to text in a text box (without having to convert it to 3d first) because of Fontwork it would do everything WordArt does and more besides. It's the gradient effect that is missing.

Sure, create a few basic styles for ease of use for those who want to knock something up quickly.

Just to respond to Dilbert - I wasn't actually saying that only Kids use it - it's just that my kid is the one in my family who does use the function - often. I agree with much of what you say. If it were to be made available I see as many people (if not more) using it as those needing an enhanced Wordcount function. To go back to the "kids" point again, everyone in every secondary school will use it at some time or another. Ignoring such a potential user base is daft.

For that reason I disagree with you on the priority - it's high. On and off I've been moaning about its absence for about 2 years now, since the days of SO5. As the user base grows, so does the demand for this function.

Ian
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DannyB
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 11, 2004 10:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It really is easy to draw gradient text without FontWork or using 3D.

1. Create empty drawing
2. Draw a text shape (style it to taste, using font, size, etc.)
3. Modify --> Convert --> To Curve
4. Format --> Area.
5. Pick Area tab. Fill set to Gradient. Pick a Gradient. Click OK.
6. Format --> Line.
7. Pick Line tag. Style to Invisible. Click OK.

Now you've got a resizable text shape filled with a gradient. It is no longer text. It is Bezier curves that are shaped like text.

Copy and Paste into Writer.

So simple even a macro could do it! Hmmmm, that gives me an idea....
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