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Section hierarchy and page layout issues
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bitman
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 31, 2006 5:56 am    Post subject: Section hierarchy and page layout issues Reply with quote

I am strugling with OO 2.0.3. Writer.

I create a document template, and add for the first page some default sections. Now I try to construct the layout of the rest of the document. So far I've been unable to insert new section for the next page. I mean I find no way after page break to start a new page layout and a new section. Very frustrating. Easy in Word, super-easy in InDesign. Possible even in Kword.. But not here. What am I doing wrong?

I can add new section, but it will be inserted in hierarchy under the first page section.

And I assume, that due to that I am unable to set page layout. If I am on in the new section on the second page and use 2fill format mode" to set the page into style "second page" (custom), it also applies to the first page. The Writer recognizes the second page layout as "default" and default only. Problem is that I need to add in the end of the document another page with different layout (copyright page), but I am unable to do so, as the layout's do not "stick".

Any suggestions?

BTW: the 2.0.3. under windows is BY FAR the buggiest software I've ever used, and I AM A BETA TESTER.

Thanks for any help Smile
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acknak
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 31, 2006 7:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's hard to follow exactly what you're trying to do, but it sounds like you're going overboard with sections. You don't need sections to get a different page format. You just apply a different page style to the pages as needed.

As you sound like an experienced user, I strongly suggest you read over the Writer User Guide, as OOo does advanced things in different (often bafflingly different) ways than other software. Sections are one such topic.

Also, as an experienced beta tester, you must know how important it is to report (clearly!) the bugs you find: QA: HowTo Help.
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BillP
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 31, 2006 7:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you want the second page to have a different style than the first page, you have to specify the second page style on the Insert Style dialog when you insert the manual page break between the first and second page.
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JohnV
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 31, 2006 8:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Put another way instead of thinking Word's Sections think OOo's Page Styles. To start a new page style do Insert > Manual Break > Page Break and select the next style or, in an existing document, put the cursor in the first paragraph of a page and do Format > Paragraph > Text Flow tab. In the Breaks section check both boxes and select the new style for the current page.

Another way to control page styles is found in the Stylist (F11) > Page Style icon > right click a style > Modify > Organizer tab > Next Style. OOo's default First Page style is set here to be followed by the Default style. The Default style is followed by itself until you change the style per the first paragraph above.
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bitman
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 31, 2006 2:39 pm    Post subject: Thank you :) Reply with quote

I thank all, who answered. In a way, I did find a solution on my own, by the way of "not giving up" Wink

I was trying to convert a template from InDesign into OOWriter, so that all our Linux and Windows users could use the same template for fast doc. generating...

I managed to finally generate the template. One thing that I was left missing, was the possibility to lock the section length - so that it would not move to another page. I can lock the content editing, but for first page content, I need just length limit.

Why I used so many sections? As I had two possibilities: (1) either to try to use tables with invisible borders for template text (logos, addresses etc.) or (2) try to put the items in their places by separate sections... In my mind it is a bit bad that user can hop from one section to another while editing the doc., but I understand that sections are a bit different from what I would like them to be.

Still, et OOWriter is the best solution for my purpose right now (and has been since 1.1), so I rather try to overcome or bypass the "problems" than find another way...

Concerning the bugs and crashes - I haven't really found a way to automate the error reporting. So far the program has just crashed and offered the recovery (which works splendidly). The crashes have occured usually while tweaking the section and page style options. If I find an error, I can reproduce, I will report it, no doubt Smile

The thing that got me frustrated was:

1) I started new document
2) Added to it first page
3) To first page I added three sections called header, title, body.
4) I also added first page footer.
5) Now I tried to move on to the next page "type" - text page. And the problem was that whenever and however I tried to create a new section to hold the text page contents, it was added as a sub-section under one of the first page sections. Thus meaning, when I tried to change the page style, it was applied to first page as well, as the section was a part of first page..

I know, it is a bit hard to see the problem, but I finally overcame it, using the browser (F5). I copied some sections and relocated contents and achieved, what I was aiming for.

So all-in-all, I look forward to possible features as locking the length of a section.

Oh, I remembered - the "total page" link insertion does not work. It is possible to insert it either from Fields->Page count (not working) or from Fields->Other->Document->Statistics->Pages.

One more thing - is there a field Author somewhere in the documents properties? For auto-inserting into template it would be very convenient.

And last thing - when I date into the document/template and reload the file, the date format has changed.. What is that about?


Smile! Smile
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pitonyak
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 31, 2006 3:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, there is a lot there!

Are you looking for Insert | Fields | Author?
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bitman
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 12:55 am    Post subject: Author Reply with quote

Yes.

I know, where from to insert it (as You kindly pointed out), but where in the menu system do I find a place to define one?

Smile
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BillP
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 3:30 am    Post subject: Re: Author Reply with quote

bitman wrote:
Yes.

I know, where from to insert it (as You kindly pointed out), but where in the menu system do I find a place to define one?

Smile


Tools > Options > OpenOffice.org > User Data
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bitman
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 4:10 am    Post subject: :) Reply with quote

Sweet Smile
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JohnV
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 6:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You can also create and define document specific variables at Insert > Fields > Other (or Ctrl+F2) > Variable tab - User Field on left, Type on right.

Lots of good stuff in the complete Fields dialog.
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PomCompot
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 12:33 pm    Post subject: Alt+Enter ... Reply with quote

... is the magic key. After fighting one hour with sections, I have found in the help how to insert a new section after and not in the section you are. A the end of the last line of your section, hit Alt+Enter, it will insert a new paragraph without any attached section. You're then free to create new ones.

Another hacky solution that I have tried before. Change the extension of you odt in zip. Open the archive and edit content.xml. Add a new couple of <p:text> tags at the end. Quite vicious but great proof of the power of opne formats.

It seems there's no mean to easily move section in the document (with drag and drop in the browser for instance).

Hope it helps.
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BillP
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 12:04 pm    Post subject: Re: Alt+Enter ... Reply with quote

PomCompot wrote:
It seems there's no mean to easily move section in the document (with drag and drop in the browser for instance).

You can drag and drop a copy of the section from the Navigator then delete the original section.
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PomCompot
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 11:56 pm    Post subject: I can't achieve to do this Reply with quote

Despite I hardly try to drag a section, it seems it's impossible to drop it or to drop a copy of it in the browser. Could you explain further the way to do this ?
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BillP
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 16, 2008 6:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You can't drag sections within the Navigator. That would rearrange the order of the sections, but wouldn't put them in the proper place in the document. To copy a section to a new place in the document, you have to drag the section from the Navigator to the document.

    Press F5 to open the Navigator.
    Right-click the section in the Navigator and select Drag Mode > Insert as copy.
    Drag the section from the Navigator window to the document.
    Right-click the original section in the Navigator and select Edit.
    On the Edit Sections dialog, select Remove.
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PomCompot
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 11:29 am    Post subject: Great Reply with quote

Thanks for the tip, it works perfectly. Anyway, it would be better if you could move section in the browser : it's just an xml tree with xml nodes switch, nothing really difficult. Perhaps I will ask for this improvment.
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