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goa103

Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 279

 Posted: Tue Dec 21, 2004 1:44 am    Post subject: Formula for x range is 0 to 255 Hello, I would like to insert a formula that means x range is 0 to 255. 0 to 255 is the set in which x is valid. The possible values of x. So I would write like to write a formula like x E [0;255]. However I can't find a way to insert the in symbol, I don't know the name of the greek letter, I think it's not epsilon, the only e-like letter I found. However I solved this greek letter problem by using the following method. To insert such a formula I first inserted a Is In set operation (a E A). I got a in text (simple text, not fields ?) and replaced by × and the next by a square bracket ([a]). I then tried to find a range Formula selection but couldn't find anything that looks like [a;b]. So I decided to just type 0;255. I got the following formula : It's only by zooming my page preview to 200% that I managed to get something readable : So my questions are : Why doesn't OOo use the E letter instead of the text in ? Is using the Is In set operation and square bracket the best way to insert a x range is 0 to 255 formula ? How can I fix the formula display ? It's like reading x E |0;255| . How can I insert a E greek letter character ? It has been a while since last time I had to write math formulas . I couldn't find any topics dealing with set formulas so I hope my method will help other users to insert correct formulas, I found the tool kind of ackward, using text instead of fields for example, using is instead of the math symbol... JM_________________An OOo mascot designer
RGB
Super User

Joined: 25 Nov 2003
Posts: 1743
Location: In Lombardy, near a glass of red Tuscany wine

Posted: Tue Dec 21, 2004 2:15 am    Post subject:

Obviously, you never used latex...
 Code: x in [0";"255]

the " " are only for avoid the italic in the semicolon.
Think of math (or latex) like a programming language: you put your code, run it and obtain a result. The function "in" insert a binary operator that mean "this belongs to that" and expect data before and after; in fact the field you are waiting for is represented by the <?>: if you look at the "real" formula, the <?> appears like a blank square. You ask
 goa103 wrote: Why doesn't OOo use the E letter instead of the text in ?

Well, what happens if you want to insert an exponential? What character you want to use in this case? Math use "exp". The term "in" has a sense in this framework, like "over" an the whole set of instructions, and is easy to understand when you catch the "soul" of the whole thing.
At least, that's my point of view.
Good luck
goa103

Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 279

Posted: Tue Dec 21, 2004 6:42 am    Post subject:

 RGB wrote: Obviously, you never used latex...

Never, you guess it well . But does it mean OOo supports Latex ? I quickly checked out the chapter about Formulas and I found nothing about Latex and a search on latex returns a No topics found.

JM
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RGB
Super User

Joined: 25 Nov 2003
Posts: 1743
Location: In Lombardy, near a glass of red Tuscany wine

 Posted: Tue Dec 21, 2004 6:59 am    Post subject: No. OOo Math has no support for latex, but work in a similar way (using code instead of graphical tools). I name it only as an example.
goa103

Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 279

Posted: Tue Dec 21, 2004 9:13 am    Post subject: Re: Formula for x range is 0 to 255

 goa103 wrote: How can I fix the formula display ? It's like reading x E |0;255| .

I found some issues about this formula display problem : square brackets in math formula are not displayed correctly and Brackets are not completely displayed.

Don't hesitate to post your comments to help us solve these issues.

JM
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RGB
Super User

Joined: 25 Nov 2003
Posts: 1743
Location: In Lombardy, near a glass of red Tuscany wine

 Posted: Wed Dec 22, 2004 8:41 am    Post subject: OK, I understand the problem now. In my system, the square brackets are displayed correctly at any scale, but I use a high resolution monitor (1152x864). I think that is a display problem: as the issue says, it seems that when the line have less than one pixel, math display round this value to zero instead to one. If you export your document to pdf what happens? Also, it could be great if you try with better resolutions and report the results
goa103

Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 279

Posted: Wed Dec 22, 2004 9:56 am    Post subject:

 RGB wrote: OK, I understand the problem now. In my system, the square brackets are displayed correctly at any scale, but I use a high resolution monitor (1152x864). I think that is a display problem: as the issue says, it seems that when the line have less than one pixel, math display round this value to zero instead to one. If you export your document to pdf what happens? Also, it could be great if you try with better resolutions and report the results

My screen resolution is 1024x768. I tried to switch to 1600x1200 and got the less display errors but there are still display errors.

1024x768

1600x1200

Once exported to PDF, I get a nice and well displayed formula :

PDF formula

But note that Adobe Reader wrongly displays the formula if I disable smoothing :

PDF formula display errors

JM
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dkeith
Power User

Joined: 01 Nov 2003
Posts: 93
Location: UK

Posted: Wed Dec 22, 2004 10:28 am    Post subject:

The issue here is purely a display problem. The formula will print and export to pdf fine. Try turning on antialiasing in your display manager / font server (or enable "font smoothing" on Windows)

You can get slightly different effects depending on how you put in the brackets, and here are a couple of ideas to get a smaller inclusion symbol:

 Code: x in [0, 255] newline x in \[ 0, 255 \] newline x in left[ 0, 255 right] newline x size*0.7 {{}in{}} [0, 255] newline x %epsilon [0, 255]

goa103

Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 279

Posted: Wed Dec 22, 2004 1:35 pm    Post subject:

 bongomaniac wrote: The issue here is purely a display problem. The formula will print and export to pdf fine. Try turning on antialiasing in your display manager / font server (or enable "font smoothing" on Windows)

Yes but enabling smoothing doesn't fix this issue. It's just a temporarly solution to get a better display.

Thanks for the tip though,
JM
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David
Super User

Joined: 24 Oct 2003
Posts: 5668

Posted: Wed Dec 29, 2004 2:58 pm    Post subject:

goa103 wrote:
 bongomaniac wrote: The issue here is purely a display problem. The formula will print and export to pdf fine. Try turning on antialiasing in your display manager / font server (or enable "font smoothing" on Windows)

Yes but enabling smoothing doesn't fix this issue. It's just a temporarly solution to get a better display.

Thanks for the tip though,
JM

The quality depends upon the programs AND the pdf tool.

Example: Mupad, sample file. Using the powerhouse Adobe, one section gave positively unreadable garbage, much worse than the examples here. Using a freeware program Broadgun pdfMachine, perfect all the way through. I use it constantly, and do a lot of math/graphics etc. with never any problem. They have the freeware and the pro version. I find all I need in the freeware version.

David.
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