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OASIS

 
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calhawk
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2005 8:54 am    Post subject: OASIS Reply with quote

I am excited by the opportunities for interoperability provided by the new ODT format, but I'm wondering if I'm missing something. I downloaded the most recent Windows beta of OOo and opened up a DOC file with embedded images, numbered lists and page numbers. That opened fine in OOo, and I proceeded to save it as ODT. I closed and reopened that file just to check it, and it looked fine.

All good, but here comes the disappointing part. I rebooted into Linux (KDE 3.4) and started up KWord, which supposedly also supports the ODT format. I tried to open the file and it was completely screwed up. The images were gone, the margins were totally different, the text was misaligned and the page numbers were gone. It wasn't even close to the original.

I guess my question is: did I do something wrong? My initial hope was that the file would translate flawlessly, since both programs are supposedly using the same open standard. What gives?
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Kaaredyret
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2005 9:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

An open file format is only about making data available in an open data format; OpenOffice and KWord are not the same, not at all. They are two different word processors that works entirely different.. same fuel, different engines.

Whatever platform, whatever software you use, I would never recommend anything else than to stick to same version of the software and the same version of the file format.

If I were you I would install OpenOffice.org 2.0 when it is ready. I just is a better suite than KOffice, an open file format doesnt save us from bad programs or bad import filters or incompatibilities between programs.

The programmers of KWord have all the knowledge to make KWord file compatible with OpenOffice, write them an e-mail and ask them to do a better job. Smile
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Last edited by Kaaredyret on Wed Sep 07, 2005 9:26 am; edited 1 time in total
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AndrewZ
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2005 9:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Which version of KOffice? OpenDocument support first came up in 1.4.0 and was improved in 1.4.1. It's possible there are some bugs in the implementation. If you are using the latest KOffice, then you should file a bug report at http://bugs.kde.org.
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AndrewZ
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2005 9:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kaaredyret wrote:
An open file format is only about making data available in an open data format; OpenOffice and KWord are not the same, not at all. They are two different word processors that works entirely different.. same fuel, different engines.


KWord is unique in that it uses a frame-based layout system more similar to desktop publishing systems than word processing software.

Kaaredyret wrote:
Whatever platform, whatever software you use, I would never recommend anything else than to stick to same version of the software and the same version of the file format.


The purpose of OpenDocument is to resolve this issue by providing a universal format that works well across different programs. In fact, the Commwealth of Mass. is adopting it as an official standard so that it can be accessed for the forseeable future (say, 100 years).

Kaaredyret wrote:
If I were you I would install OpenOffice.org 2.0 when it is ready. I just is a better suite than KOffice, an open file format doesnt save us from bad programs or bad import filters or incompatibilities between programs.


While I find OpenOffice.org more robust than KOffice, the latter is much faster. As for the bugs, there will be some, but let them be reported and fixed.
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calhawk
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2005 9:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the many interesting comments.

Quote:
The purpose of OpenDocument is to resolve this issue by providing a universal format that works well across different programs.


That was my impression as well. I guess I was expecting ODT to function more like PDF in that different programs across different platforms could read and write it effectively.

Quote:
Which version of KOffice? OpenDocument support first came up in 1.4.0 and was improved in 1.4.1.


I believe I have the latest update. It seems like this could be a major incompatibility problem and might take a version or two to get sorted out.

Quote:
If I were you I would install OpenOffice.org 2.0 when it is ready. I just is a better suite than KOffice, an open file format doesnt save us from bad programs or bad import filters or incompatibilities between programs.


I like KOffice quite a bit, although I know it doesn't have nearly the same features as OOo. It's fast, works smoothly and looks pretty. If I used Linux exclusively it would be my primary office suite, no question.
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fedetxf
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2005 10:00 am    Post subject: KOffice Reply with quote

Just in case this is not as clear as it can be, let me explain why KOffice did not show the document well.

When you read the ODT file, as it is a standard you know how it is formatted and what to expect, but you may not support showing/editing/representing some of the data inside in your application.

I am not familiar with KOffice, but suppose KOffice did not support embeding images inside documents, when they open an ODT containing them they must drop the image or tell the user they can't represent the document because some features are not implemented in KOffice.

But as the ODT is open, as soon as they implement embeded images, they can have that even when the ODT came from a different application.

There's a separation between the information represented in the ODT and the information supported by the application.
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Kaaredyret
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2005 10:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

The purpose of OpenDocument is to resolve this issue by providing a universal format that works well across different programs


The format does solve the issue with programs not supporting it 100%, of course it is easier with an open format, but look at KOffice right now. Programs have to work pretty much like each other before they are almost totally compatible. KWord uses frames, some other programs does not. They cannot translate each others features to something that works in both.

And programs evolve. OpenOffice.org 2.0 introduces shapes not available in OpenOffice 1.1.4 and several tweaks. In order for the end user to get total compatibility, he/she HAS to use compatible versions of the software. File formats does not resolve that issue.
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AndrewZ
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2005 10:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

calhawk wrote:
Quote:
Which version of KOffice? OpenDocument support first came up in 1.4.0 and was improved in 1.4.1.


I believe I have the latest update. It seems like this could be a major incompatibility problem and might take a version or two to get sorted out.


You should be able to check by clicking the Help menu then About. That's where most programs show their version numbers.

If you are using a previous version of KOffice, it's possible that it is trying to use the OpenOffice.org filter, which may be similar enough to load something (?) but different enough to cause problems.
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